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Creation vs. evolution debate?   

I believe in Creation and that Macro evolution is a fairy tale.

I believe the earth is about 6,000 years old.

If you believe I am wrong

If you want do debate me intelligently

I welcome your response.

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Posted: 2/23/2009 at 14:19Read 751 times | 36 comments | Leave Comment 
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Just to let you know I was here.;0)
Reply | 8/20/2009 7:21:07 AM
“He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.” Revelation 2:17
Reply | 7/19/2009 1:42:07 PM
debating evolution and creationism against one another is like arguing apples and oranges against each other. it just really is not a fair debate. now if you want to debate the bible in and of itself because there's a lot of material ther that up against cultural and historical context can take an ordinary mind for a spin and if you want to debate about evolution the science is clear not unreasonable but arguing one subject against the other is simply playing a game of one illogical fallacy against the other in a tandem dualistic conflicting conversation and i just don't see the point. Unfortunately the 'language' is not suitable for wrapping the two conversations together. Technically speaking though God can 'create' anyway he wants and if evolution is part of his technique then so be it. no big deal. praise God!
Reply | 6/30/2009 3:07:41 PM
no big deal?? if one part of Gods word is not true then we cant trust the rest of the bible ...VERY BIG DEAL.
Reply | 6/30/2009 8:37:27 PM
well all i've got to say on this matter is that i respect and trust and love the other animals far more than most human animals. sure they don't talk back but between humans i think communication and certainly listening is lacking whereas critters are far more successful except when humans interfere of course.
Reply | 6/29/2009 8:44:53 PM
Oh !! my I keep reading and find it interesting that you and Lady Macbeth came to a silence..I am here neutral I don't know what to believe ...I was raised with a father who believed we lived in a 'goldfish bowl' and loved the challenge of any religion arriving at the door.he believed when we found the answer to creation the world as we know it would end.....My mother was christian..
We are becoming a very inquisitive people and the more technology at hand the more we want to know..and change..so we could have started off primitive going forward learning changing form with each discovery,,,the gods came with the need for leaders .then the stories left as diaries..
Reply | 6/20/2009 9:51:03 AM
thanks for leaving a comment Some people stop leaving comments because they are loosing the debate...thats my comment on that lol no offense meant to anyone here just being funny.

As for your other comments look into it find out what science and archeology have discovered about the bible and whats in it. ;-)
Reply | 6/20/2009 12:04:47 PM
Believe me. People aren't stopping with their comments because they feel they are 'losing the debate'. Evolutionary processes have already been proven as fact. We don't really have to defend our position. Personally I like to occasionally 'debate' with creationists because it's amusing. Listen, I'm honestly not trying to convince you. I'm aware that you get your ideas from a very old and unchanging set of beliefs and that the bible must be extremely convincing to you but just remember that there is a whole world out there. And everyday we're discovering new and amazing things about the way life and the universe work. It's just a shame you have to ignore these new facts and try and make excuses for why they aren't valid.
Reply | 6/21/2009 12:59:17 AM
You failed to show me a fact that proves that I am wrong...so it seems you believe your point of view on faith too.
Reply | 6/26/2009 5:56:07 PM
(There wasn't enough room to finish in the last comment so I am having to start a new one) No one was around to witness the Big Bang, so believing in Big Bang is more of an act of Faith, not evidence. Taking explosions for what they are scientifically shows that there can be no life started from this theory. It is difficult to believe that a scientific explosion can create the numerous separate functions of bodies in animals and humans, create thousand of different species of plants, flowers, animals, ocean life, stars and planets. All of the earth has a design and different life forms. That must come from a living being who is very, very intelligent, beyond our understanding and comprehension. It is more logical to believe in someone else out there who's intelligence gave birth to life forms than to believe that all these different life forms came from a desolating explosion. Peace-
Reply | 6/20/2009 7:18:08 AM
The Big Bang theory does not describe an 'explosion'. But rather an 'expansion' from a singularity(a very, very small and dense point in existence, similar to what we call black holes). And no 'separate functions of bodies in animals and humans... thousand of different species of plants, flowers, animals, ocean life, stars and planets.' would certainly not present in their current form after the big bang. That is what evolution is for.
I'm also not saying I believe in the big bang. It is still a theory. But a good theory because as astronomers have observers, the universe IS expanding. So if it is expanding, then, from what point is it expanding?
Reply | 6/20/2009 12:14:30 PM
Well the bile does say that God stretched out the heavens

Isaiah 45:12 and Jeremiah 10:12

I wonder how they knew thousands of years ago that the universe was expanding mmmm

So you don't believe in the big bang? So where did we come from?
Reply | 6/27/2009 5:44:45 AM
In all fairness, let's for a minute take a look at the concept behind 'the Big Bang ' theory. The big band theory is just that. A collision or explosion of matter and the belief that all life was developed from this explosion. To use an analogy of this explosion, let's bring it down to a smaller scale for our eyes to witness this collision.
We are going to take a couple hand sized rocks from the earth and put it in a pile. Now lets take a couple of vegetables (amino acids) put them in the same pile. We can add grass, leaves from a tree, and a little something from every plant and animal that the earth has to offer. The next step is we need to witness a collision of all these elements and see what will grow from it. So, we can take a stick of dinamite and place that on the top pile and light it.
What we have now is the explosion part of the experiment.
What is left? The evidence is, there will be nothing left. Nothing can be built from or grow from an any explosion.
Reply | 6/20/2009 7:05:10 AM
I agree that it just cant happen by chance.iEvolution is just another religion.
Reply | 6/20/2009 8:16:32 AM
“This book of the law shall not depart out of thy mouth; but thou shalt meditate therein day and night, that thou mayest observe to do according to all that is written therein: for then thou shalt make thy way prosperous, and then thou shalt have good success.” Joshua 1:8
Reply | 6/19/2009 1:25:36 PM
Evolution vs creation isn't something people often debate about these days it seems.The truth of evolution is really just considered common knowledge.

What evidence is there for evolution? Not much I guess. Oh well then again I guess we could count the over 200,000 peer reviewed scientific papers containing millions of individual pieces of evidence, collected by tens of thousands of scientists working over the past century and a half. And the legal ruling of the United States Judicial system as a result of all of this evidence.

It just boggles my mind how anyone today could still believe that the earth is only 6000 years old.
I'm not saying you should stop believing in your god or in Jesus,but don't ignore what's right in front of you. Staring you in the face.

There is no debate here.Evolution is the truth.

Those who cling to old stories are thankfully becoming fewer and fewer in numbers with the increased quality of eduction and our understandings of the world ar
Reply | 6/19/2009 12:48:19 PM
Thank you for responding I will reply by asking you some simple questions the first being where did we come from?
Reply | 6/19/2009 1:01:15 PM
The short answer is; Amino acids(a.k.a The building blocks of life) which are able to form from chemical reactions unrelated to life itself(this has been proven by science), do just that. Through evolution over billions of years these compounds are able to form into more and more complex proteins and eventually all matter of organisms.
We as humans are still trying to undertand more about how this process works, but those are the basics.

Next question?
Reply | 6/19/2009 1:50:31 PM
oh cool its been proven by science where is your proof?
Reply | 6/20/2009 6:29:05 AM
Look up 'Miller–Urey experiment'. It is just one example of this.
So where is your intelligent debate? I am waiting.
Reply | 6/20/2009 12:08:30 PM
I am well aware of this experiment it tried to prove abiogenesis which is the theory that under the proper conditions life can arise spontaneously from non-living molecules.
in there experiment they left out oxygen because oxidization would destroy anything they could make so the problem is you cant create life with oxygen but you also need oxygen for life. there are many other reasons abiogenesis wont fly but but lack of room prevents me from posting it here. if you want more info just ask.
Reply | 6/27/2009 6:04:55 AM
And what's wrong with descending from a rock, as you call it? I think the problem here is we humans are so used to be on top of the world we have trouble adjusting to a world that WASN´T created specifically to accomodate US, that's why some people believe in creation. Easier to beleive God created this world just for us to be in it. Well, since I don't believe the world revolves around my belly button and, furthermore, believe to be as important as the smallest bacteria on earth, I for one have no problem in believing in big bang and be HAPPY to be the descendant of that glourious event.
Reply | 5/15/2009 9:10:33 AM
Thank you Lady for your post you ask

What's wrong with descending from a rock?

In that world life has no value there is no right no wrong.

In that kind of world people should kill there kids so they don't have the expense of raising them.

And I don't have enough faith to think that nothing exploded and made everything.

I await you response.
Reply | 5/16/2009 9:12:25 AM
It's a good point you make. First, let me ask you: do you believe in television? You don't have to because it's right there in front of you, right? Well, as for descending from a rock, it is still a matter of belief. We don't have proof and I'm not sure we'll ever have it. But there is endless evidence that the earth is older than you believe, and that's just one. I like the Bible. It's a great book. I am a Catholic. But the bible was written by men. And even if you believe God inspired the writing, don't you think it's possible, just possible, He chose to make it simple so that we'd understand it, rather than make it factual? I believe the Bible is a symbolic poem.
As for life having no value because it comes from a rock, why do you say that? Do you think the means deny the purpose? What if God designed it to be that way?
Reply | 5/16/2009 9:41:59 AM
You are right about it being a matter of belief they are both religions.

Endless evidence that the earth is older than I believe?

I think there are a lot of unprovable theories.

Lets put it on trial...show just one empirical evidence that I am wrong

Concerning the Bible I believe the bible to be without error (old King James) and that he did make it easy to understand.

You said
'As for life having no value because it comes from a rock, why do you say that? Do you think the means deny the purpose? What if God designed it to be that way?'

Now wait do you believe in God or not? hehe

And I want to thank you for participating in this discussion.
Reply | 5/16/2009 10:40:03 AM
I can offer no evidence YOU would accept ;) Being a scientist, I find myself in this debate more often than not, and what I know for sure is that it's very hard to sway a creationist away from his convictions, simply because they put faith on top of physical evidence. I know I'm not going to win this argument, at leat not with you.

As for believing in God, let's just say I do, today.
Reply | 5/16/2009 11:19:02 AM
You are a scientist? how cool am I in for a whoopin now?
I am first Impressed and secondly ready to say

BRING IT ON!




Reply | 5/16/2009 11:35:53 AM
Why impressed?

Come on, why should i offer you what for me is proof? I've just read your starlight 'explanation'. Anything I say, you can always reply that God is almighty and could have done it Himself.
Reply | 5/16/2009 12:21:30 PM
well we are at a stand still now because you cant give proof and neither can I I guess we will leave it up the the readers to say who won this one.
Reply | 5/18/2009 1:16:11 PM
maybe it's possible to believe in both creation and evolution.
For me I think things had to have been created at sometime right? Well I think it was much longer then 6000 years ago though. I mean that's impossible for everything to be 6000 years old. For example then how would the star light reach us? Some of the stars we can see are more then 10,000 light years away from us(we can tell the distance by parallax displacement, search on google if are not familiar with it.), so if things where created just 6000 years ago, we would not be able to see that light yet. The Hubble telescope has even photographed galaxies which are many millions of light years away.
Also if there is no evolution then how do you explain different colors of skin? The differences in skin colors are genetic variations that have developed over time. We didn't all start out this way. Especially if you believe in Adam and Eve, then you can not deny that?
Reply | 5/12/2009 11:10:03 PM
Remember what evolution is... its the big bang theory.

You have to believe we are descendants of a rock.

As for starlight I think you are limiting what God can do.I think he is quite capable of making the stars with the light already in place, when he made Adam and Eve do you think he made new born babes or where they fully grown?

When he made the garden of eden was it bare land with seeds in the ground or was it a fully mature garden?
Reply | 5/13/2009 3:33:11 AM
-Evolution is the change in the genetic material of a population of organisms from one generation to the next.
-The Big Bang is a cosmological model of the initial conditions and subsequent development of the universe.

They are two different subjects.


In any case. You already seem to have all the answers. What''s the use in discussing this if you can simply reply to everything with ''God did it''?

This reminds of when I was a child and would ask my grandmother ''why is the sky blue?'' and she would reply ''because God made it that way''. Since I was very young I didn''t know any better and accepted it. Now of course I know the sky is blue because molecules in the air scatter blue light from the sun more than they scatter red light.
Reply | 5/16/2009 11:59:47 PM
And God made it that way> hehe all kidding aside I have never used because God made it that way. If you have something to say pic a subject and state if then say it and I will do my best to scientifically defend my view so far I dont see anything from you
Reply | 5/18/2009 1:24:58 PM
With respect Duke you did seem to use the God did it answer when I mentioned the distance of stars.
As for 'when God made Adam and Eve do you think he made new born babes or where they fully grown?'
Well personally I don't believe God created an Adam or Eve. To me God is something spiritual and personal for everyone and not something you can learn about from a book.
Reply | 5/26/2009 11:55:42 PM
Travis I want you to look up something 'The conservation of angular momentum' tell me when you understand it. I have a fact that will make you think.

Secondly Adam and Eve where made fully grown.

Ponder what came first the chicken or the egg?
Reply | 6/17/2009 4:40:48 AM
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Reply | 5/10/2009 5:52:50 PM
um I believe in creation but we are forever evolving so I also believe in science that the earth could be 6 billion years old as earth was created before man God created all things in 6 days but what if the 7th day is still going and when it ends all things start over?
Reply | 5/4/2009 6:48:45 AM
How are we evolving Kenny?

Also check this out to see if God meant a 24 hour day

http://ww9.yuwie.com/blog/entry.asp?id=159707&eid=580658
Reply | 5/4/2009 7:02:57 AM
In biology, evolution is change in the genetic material of a population of organisms from one generation to the next.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution
Reply | 5/4/2009 8:05:32 AM
what kind of change Kenny?
Reply | 5/4/2009 7:55:08 PM
Hi I can answer this. A simple example is this. When we observe birds of the same species though living on two separate islands. on one island the birds have short beaks and on the other they have long beaks. On the island with the long beaked birds there were more rocks where the bugs could hide. the birds on that island evolved to have longer beaks which could reach the bugs. This is only one example of many thousands we have observed.
As far as changes in the human species. For some easy to see changes just look at the average heights in relation to different regions on the earth. different facial features etc. And like I said up there, the most obvious being skin color. ;)
Reply | 5/12/2009 11:28:42 PM
Travis that is just a variation in the same kind of animal. what I am debating the big bang thing here
Reply | 5/14/2009 12:21:22 PM
What I am debating is one kind of animal producing a different kind Dogs produce all kinds of offsspring but its always a dog
Reply | 7/4/2009 6:09:13 AM
Hi,

I believe the Bible and Gen. 1:1 where it states, 'In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.' I believe Adam was made just as it states in, Gen. 2:7 - 'And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and beathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a lilving soul.' As for Eve - Gen. 2: 21,22 - 'And the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof; And the rib, which the Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman and brought her unto the man.' Remember God cannot lie -- this is God's Word! This is what I believe.

Your friend,
Gladys
Reply | 4/13/2009 1:16:25 PM
I believe in evolution.
Why? I suppose because I wasn't brought up with religion and all that so my mind is free to learn and accept new ideas and concepts without any restrictions.
People used to believe that the Sun revolved around the earth as well. I just can't understand how with all that we now know because of the trials and errors of science, people can still believe the earth is only 6,000 years old.
I do not consider myself an atheist as I don't claim to know how and if the universe was created and what happens for sure after we pass on but I hold a firm belief that all religions here on earth have it all very wrong and that only through further research can we ever hope to understand the truth to our beginnings.
Reply | 4/5/2009 5:03:57 PM
I know where your coming from I was brought up the same way. I believed in evolution because that was what I was taught in school. I mean it seems reasonable right? And why would you question it? Its science right? Actually its not science I found that all of the evidence I was shown for evolution was either a lie or could not be proved because it was just opinion.
I don't mind listening to other ideas or concepts but if there is no proof to back it up its just a theory.

Science does not prove the earth is millions of years old please give me your best proof or evidence of the earth being millions of years old .

As to you last statement research proving the Bible to be true.

And lastly I want to say your post is very well written and like I said I can relate to everything you are saying because I was there once and agreed completely at one time. I await your reply.
Reply | 4/5/2009 5:27:19 PM
Hi. I was wondering do you hold the belief that all existence(the universe) was created at the same time as Earth and humans or that the universe existed before 6000 years ago?
I'm asking because I'm more knowledgeable about astronomy rather then geology. And I can explain how we know that the universe is older then 6000 years old a lot easier then how we know the earth is older then 6000 years old.
Reply | 5/3/2009 7:38:22 PM
oh yah, sorry I couldn't reply sooner. i just don't get on here much, but when I do I will be happy to reply. This is a debate that has my interest. Too bad there aren't more replies just yet.
Reply | 5/3/2009 7:40:37 PM

DUKE-OF-URL
[This user is online right now!]
Yes I do and would be happy do discuss the age of the universe.

Lets just start with where did the planets come from?
Reply | 5/4/2009 6:26:00 AM
Planets such as the earth are formed when nebulas(clouds of dust, hydrogen, helium and plasma) collapse under gravity. Particles are forced together and become larger particles. These large clumps of matter now have their own force of gravity and develop rotations which smooth out them out into sphere-like objects.
Reply | 6/4/2009 12:10:00 PM
One cannot live with wool over his eyes. We cannot deny the fact that man has evolved/survived in his because of survival instinct and brain, albeit not always used in a good way and keeping his dreams alive. If it weren't for dreams we'd all be dead or living in the stone age and not be able to share our thoughts with the world from the comforts of our homes. Heck, fire probably would never have been discovered, let alone used.

Seriously, dinosaurs in all different shapes and sizes after 1840? What about all the archeological sites and carbon dating? Some species die and some appear over the years, even centuries. 500 years from now who knows what the our world will look like. Truth is, life in all forms adapts to its environment. If man had been around at the same time as the dinosaurs, I don't think humans would have ever survived. I believe in evolution because it makes so much more sense to me than some single entity who created everything in 7 days. Spirituality vs. religio
Reply | 4/3/2009 12:03:29 AM
First of Patrick thank you so much for taking me on here so few will.

You say 'We cannot deny the fact that man has evolved'..fact? you have any evidence for this?

What I said is the word dinosaur didn't exist till after 1840.

Archeology has proven nothing to support evolution in fact it supports a young earth and the flood of Noah.

Carbon dating is based on unprovable assumptions I can go into this alot more if I had the room here but go and read this article if you want to see the problem with Carbon 14 it will explain it.

http://www.drdino.com/read-article.php?id=72

'Some species die and some appear '? I need better clarification on this... like an example.

I want to thank you again for debating me on this. On your next entry lets narrow it down to one thing because my responses take up so much room and I have limited space to work with here hehe

Reply | 4/3/2009 6:33:28 AM
I believe in creation but I get caught up with the time thing.
Methuselah was supposed to have lived to be 969 years old.....................
Methuselah is mentioned in Genesis as the son of Enoch and the father of Lamech (father of Noah), whom he fathered at the age of 187. A close reading of the dates in the Old Testament reveals that Methuselah is said to have died in the year of the Great Flood, but the Bible does not say that he was among those who died in the flood. Some have interpreted his name as a prophecy: when he dies, the Flood will come. In that case, the long life has an allegorical dimension, showing that God withheld judgment on humans for a very long time.

According to the Bible, he reached the age of 969 years. Genesis 5:27 states, 'And all the days of Methuselah were nine hundred sixty and nine years: and he died' (American Standard Version). Genesis 5:5 states, 'So all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years, and he died.' (American Standa
Reply | 4/2/2009 7:56:19 PM
what part do you have trouble with hun ?
Reply | 4/2/2009 8:46:48 PM
Hi Duke...this is a great debate.

Reply | 4/2/2009 7:52:21 PM
A good debate which reminds me of many on another site more than a year ago. I'm sorry, but you'll have no debate with me. I agree with you.

More importantly, I agree with the Bible. While it does not set out to be a book of history, science, archaeology or anything else besides the revealed will of God and His dealings with His people, where it touches on these and other subjects, it is totally accurate.

Diggings have found ruins to be exactly where the Bible recorded them to be many hundreds of years before they were found. Of note is Hezekiah's tunnel, ridiculed by unbelievers for many years, but now a tourist attraction.

Then we could consider prophecies. Every single one of hundreds of prophecies regarding Jesus Christ and many other people and places have been fulfilled exactly as predicted hundreds of years before the event.

History agrees with historical events recorded. I believe the earth is 6000+ years old and all arguments to the contrary CAN be answered.
Reply | 3/20/2009 10:11:09 PM

Cloudwatcher, I don't dispute any of that. It's a beautiful thing. But the Bible is full of history. It excels in history, because it was written by man-- inspired by God; but by man, nevertheless.

However, the Bible is practically quiet on the creation of the universe. Yes, it gives us a TASTE; but I believe it is just that, a miniscule taste.

How can we claim that that is all there is to the creation process, when life itself, is so complex. Life's infinite complexity and yet its symbiosis is why so many scientists are convinced that there is a Creator behind it all.

Do I think that Genesis says all there is to know about Creation? No. The books of science that have filled the libraries since Babylonian times up to now are themselves a testament to the wonder of God's design and natural laws; and our endless resolve to discover more about them.
Reply | 3/21/2009 12:39:25 AM
The Bible devotes the whole first chapter on creation. And I think it explains it fully, he spoke and it was..its that simple.

Gen 2:1 reads 'Thus the heavens and the earth were finished,and all the host of them.

When the Bible says heavens and earth are finished I think it means exactly what it says.

Also 'Conservation of mass' a fundamental principle of classical physics states that matter cannot be created or destroyed.
Reply | 3/21/2009 7:16:06 PM
I have to agree with you there - or to be correct, I agree with the Word as you have stated here.

God said it was finished: it was perfect. There was and never will be any need for 'more' work. Yes, it is true that WE have misused His creation, the creation over which we were given control, but God's work was complete.

I believe God. I have done so for 50 of my 72 years, and never once have I found any reason to alter that. Never once, from the Word, from His promises, or from theories of man. Nothing in the Word of God has ever been disproved. It has been ridiculed and thought to be wrong, but in time has been found to be correct.

Why should I believe a theory of man above the spoken Word of God? Why should I believe a theory of man - that changes, and changes, and changes? I believe God.

Reply | 3/23/2009 5:54:34 PM
Amen. ;-)
Reply | 4/2/2009 8:54:11 PM
Umm..I have no beliefs..To me the bible is a storybook like any other.....I have the greatest respect for other peoples beliefs..I would love for someone to tell me the beginning and give me something to believe in...
I see so much war blood shed and tears with religion involved..
Reply | 3/15/2009 2:12:22 PM
yes alot of wars seem to be about religion but I think that's just the reason they use to rally their people to support it. If there was no religion of any kind they would still hate there enemy and they would still want their land.
Reply | 3/16/2009 6:13:03 AM
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